One conversation at a STEM job fair changed Zach Christensen’s career path. Years later, that unexpected introduction to medical devices would help shape a business built around improving people’s lives.
In episode 49 of The Personal Side of Business, Jet Bunditwong sits down with Zach Christensen and Micah Parrish of Lifestyle Medical to explore the people, relationships, and decisions behind building their company in Logan, Utah.
Zach shares his leap into entrepreneurship, while Micah explains why he went from investing in the business to joining its team—and why he interviewed the company just as carefully as it interviewed him.
Together, they discuss:
- Hiring for humility, curiosity, and character.
- Turning an idea into a medical device with real patient impact.
- Moving forward without waiting for perfection.
- Finding mentors and staying open to feedback.
- Building a team where good ideas can come from anyone.
Whether you’re starting a business, leading a team, or wondering if you’re ready to take your next step, this conversation offers a reminder: meaningful progress starts with the right people and the willingness to keep learning.
CONNECT WITH LIFESTYLE
Lifestyle Medical — family of companies:
https://lifestyleengr.com/lifestyle-medical
Lifestyle Engineering — medical device design and development:
https://lifestyleengr.com/
Lifestyle Manufacturing:
https://lifestylemfg.com/
Lifestyle Additive — 3D printing:
https://lifestyleadditive.com/
Helping Hearts & Hands — nonprofit:
https://lmhhh.org/
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https://www.linkedin.com/in/jet-bunditwong-50937a4/
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00:00 --> 00:03 My dad's a mechanical engineer, but he works on facilities like heating and air
00:03 --> 00:07 conditioning. Yeah. And so he likes dew points and those kind of things.
00:08 --> 00:11 So I went to school thinking I'd probably do something similar to him or in
00:12 --> 00:16 aviation or aerospace. But I went to a little STEM
00:16 --> 00:20 job fair and there was a lot of big companies and I was like
00:21 --> 00:23 scared to talk to this one, scared to talk to this one. There was a
00:23 --> 00:27 lady with just a little tablecloth that said Innovative Medical Device Solutions.
00:27 --> 00:30 And I was like, she looks friendly. I'll talk to her. 45 minutes later,
00:30 --> 00:33 she's like, you got to come in interview at this place and I realized that
00:34 --> 00:37 mechanical engineers can work on medical devices. Welcome to
00:37 --> 00:41 The Personal Side of Business, where you hear real stories from
00:41 --> 00:43 real entrepreneurs.
00:51 --> 00:55 Hi, welcome to The Personal Side of Business, where every
00:55 --> 00:59 business has a story. I'm your host, Jeff Bunduwal. Today my guests are Zach
00:59 --> 01:03 Christensen and Micah Parrish of Lifestyle Medical. A company helping innovators
01:03 --> 01:06 develop, manufacture, and launch medical devices.
01:06 --> 01:10 Welcome to the podcast, Zach and Micah. Ah, Jed, it's a pleasure.
01:10 --> 01:14 Yeah, wonderful to be here. So let's start with my
01:14 --> 01:18 always beginning question: how did we get here? Let's start with both your stories.
01:18 --> 01:21 So, uh, we, we actually—
01:22 --> 01:25 Micah and I both worked at a previous company doing medical device development, kind of
01:25 --> 01:29 like we do today. Um, that company sold a couple times while
01:29 --> 01:32 we were there. We just saw it kind of outgrow our, our area where
01:32 --> 01:35 we're at here, and Kind of the writing was on the wall. So,
01:36 --> 01:40 we had a group of local investors. We never took any outside money. We just
01:41 --> 01:44 pulled together some people with some good ideas. And I was the
01:44 --> 01:48 first to jump ship and start Lifestyle Medical. I had a non-compete in the
01:49 --> 01:52 medical device space, so we actually started in the durable medical equipment
01:53 --> 01:57 space. We started a little store called HSA Depot. And I did that for a
01:57 --> 02:01 year. And then, once we had that up and going and my non-compete
02:01 --> 02:05 was out, we started an engineering group. 6 months later, we started a machine shop,
02:05 --> 02:09 and now 3 or 4 years later, we're, uh, we're just running on all cylinders.
02:09 --> 02:13 We're at 40 folks in the company, and it's just been awesome
02:14 --> 02:17 to see everybody just come together and learn new skills and make
02:18 --> 02:21 it happen. That's awesome. And Micah, how— when did you come on board?
02:22 --> 02:25 Um, like Zach said, I worked with him and a
02:25 --> 02:29 lot of the group that actually works here today, and I was approached
02:30 --> 02:32 by one of the founders just to see, hey, would you be interested in investing
02:32 --> 02:35 in the company? So I kind of started out as an investor. Me and my
02:35 --> 02:38 wife, we purchased some shares in the company or some percentage
02:39 --> 02:42 in the company, and then just kind of kept in contact.
02:42 --> 02:47 And in all honesty, it was really refreshing because we
02:47 --> 02:50 were invited to a lot of the board meetings. We were invited to a lot
02:50 --> 02:53 of like the kind of what we call pulse meetings where they kind of go
02:54 --> 02:57 over all the logistics and very open about how the company's doing,
02:57 --> 03:00 what's going on in the company. So we were able to get a really good
03:00 --> 03:03 view of how the company was run, who was in the company,
03:03 --> 03:07 and felt even more, even better about our investment in the company.
03:08 --> 03:11 So after a little while, I reached out, I was
03:11 --> 03:15 looking for a change in work and reached out and they
03:16 --> 03:20 were, they still went through the interview process, still went through design
03:20 --> 03:23 challenge and kind of see where I was at with my skill level and what
03:24 --> 03:28 I could bring to the table. And I interviewed them right back and
03:28 --> 03:31 asked them a bunch of questions and kind of got into depth about what the
03:32 --> 03:35 culture was like and how things were running. He passed with flying colors.
03:36 --> 03:39 It's fun. That was what I wanted to highlight here. Micah went from
03:39 --> 03:43 investor to full-time contributor. So it's a cool seat
03:43 --> 03:47 for him to— after we already had— the engineering team was 12
03:47 --> 03:51 or 13 people, maybe more when you joined. So for him coming over and adding
03:51 --> 03:54 a lot of experience, Micah has a lot of experience in different areas.
03:55 --> 03:58 I think that's something that's really helped us is we've brought in very
03:59 --> 04:02 strategically people that have had experience from different areas. Even our
04:02 --> 04:06 interns, some of the ones that have thrived the most are ones that
04:06 --> 04:09 had internships a couple other places first. So they see some of
04:10 --> 04:14 the experiences from bigger companies, companies that have more kind
04:14 --> 04:18 of form and shape, and they come and they add their ideas.
04:18 --> 04:21 And I think we take that as a high priority. We always try and be
04:21 --> 04:24 open to new ideas and hear out From the person that's only been
04:24 --> 04:28 here 3 days to the person that's been here the longest. Yeah, and I think
04:28 --> 04:31 that was— it's not just not the experience,
04:31 --> 04:35 right? You guys, there's a driving force of culture that you guys
04:35 --> 04:38 want to instill in this whole entire workplace.
04:39 --> 04:42 So you guys are probably looking for that element that— so
04:42 --> 04:46 that person that comes in should have the experience but should also be able
04:46 --> 04:49 to fit into your culture here as company.
04:50 --> 04:53 And Zach, you know, when we went to lunch, you were talking about that,
04:53 --> 04:56 that, uh, there's this process that you go through where you're—
04:56 --> 05:00 it's not just a phone interview and you get to come on board. Can you
05:00 --> 05:03 talk a little bit about what you're looking for for someone to come on board?
05:03 --> 05:06 Yeah, and I— someone early on, because, you know, me being
05:06 --> 05:09 the first one in the company, somebody gave me the advice along the way that
05:10 --> 05:13 hiring is the most important thing that you do. And I honestly agree with
05:14 --> 05:16 that. And as you grow in a business, that's one of the last things that
05:17 --> 05:20 you delegate. Like you really, you want to delegate the day-to-day work. You want to
05:21 --> 05:24 delegate, give people, empower people to be able to take on their jobs.
05:25 --> 05:29 Hiring is the entry point. Like it's that important. So as
05:30 --> 05:33 a, as a group, we actually have a 12-step program
05:33 --> 05:37 that walks from the very first interaction all the way to hiring
05:37 --> 05:41 them. And Micah alluded to that earlier. There was even a design challenge.
05:41 --> 05:44 Like if they're an engineer, they, they sit down and spend a couple
05:44 --> 05:48 hours working on a a reverse-engineered product so they
05:49 --> 05:52 can just see what we're about. They study a surgical technique guide and they do
05:52 --> 05:55 it. So we have phone screens, we have the design challenge,
05:55 --> 05:58 we bring them in for a tour so they can meet a few more team
05:58 --> 06:01 members, um, we take them out to lunch usually.
06:02 --> 06:05 At the time we make an offer, we usually take them and their significant
06:05 --> 06:09 other out to dinner. So that significant other, that's where we've seen that they
06:09 --> 06:13 gain a lot of trust in that type of setting. Like, not many companies do
06:13 --> 06:17 something like that. So It's fun to be able to have them have that experience,
06:17 --> 06:20 ask the questions. And, uh, and it really comes down to what are
06:21 --> 06:24 we looking for? And we've taken a framework and kind of built on it,
06:24 --> 06:27 but it's, we look for hunger, we look for humble, we look for
06:28 --> 06:30 humane because they gotta be able to get along with people. They gotta be able
06:30 --> 06:34 to take feedback and learn, and they gotta be just
06:34 --> 06:37 trying to learn new skills all along the way. And then I've kind of added
06:38 --> 06:40 another one, humor. They gotta have a little bit of that as they go.
06:40 --> 06:43 They gotta be able to, to not take themselves too seriously.
06:44 --> 06:47 Yeah. I think it's, you know,
06:47 --> 06:51 I don't know, it feels like it's getting harder and harder to find because you're
06:51 --> 06:56 getting, um, all the studies keep showing that there's less qualified
06:56 --> 06:59 people coming in because they're just, you know, for some reason or another, they just
07:00 --> 07:03 don't— not interested or don't have the background for it. Um, where do you
07:04 --> 07:07 guys feel like you get your, your best recruits from?
07:08 --> 07:12 So this maybe leans to what Micah was talking about earlier. It comes
07:12 --> 07:15 back to relationships. A lot of the people we've hired somebody
07:16 --> 07:19 in our company has worked for, worked with them at some other point,
07:20 --> 07:23 or they've, you know, even from some college
07:24 --> 07:27 student, it might be they worked on their senior design project together. So that comes
07:27 --> 07:29 with, you've gained a level of trust already.
07:30 --> 07:34 And I'm a firm believer that, you know, people that put their effort in
07:35 --> 07:37 at one point, they usually put it in all the time. They're kind of just
07:38 --> 07:41 wired that way. And I think it's fortunate that we're kind of in a town
07:41 --> 07:45 where there's a university. We have good relationships there. Usually myself and
07:45 --> 07:48 a couple of the other leaders leadership team will go and present in a couple
07:48 --> 07:51 of engineering classes up at USU and just talk about our culture, talk about what
07:52 --> 07:55 we do, talk about medical devices. Because honestly, I didn't know engineers could
07:55 --> 07:59 do medical devices. My dad's a mechanical engineer, but he
07:59 --> 08:03 works on facilities like heating and air conditioning. Yeah. And so he
08:03 --> 08:06 likes dew points and those kind of things. So I went to school
08:06 --> 08:11 thinking I'd probably do something similar to him, or in aviation or aerospace,
08:11 --> 08:14 but I went to a little, uh, STEM job fair,
08:15 --> 08:18 and there was a lot of big companies, and I was like scared to talk
08:19 --> 08:21 to this one, scared to talk to this one. There's a lady with just a
08:21 --> 08:25 little tablecloth that said Innovative Medical Device Solutions,
08:25 --> 08:28 and I was like, she looks friendly, I'll talk to her. 45 minutes later,
08:28 --> 08:31 she's like, you got to come and interview at this place. And I, I realized
08:31 --> 08:35 that mechanical engineers can work on medical devices. Oh, and now, like, I mean,
08:36 --> 08:40 this is maybe more question for you. I— if someone's
08:40 --> 08:43 coming in and has that idea, what's the process
08:43 --> 08:46 like? That from like, I just have this great idea, I want to,
08:47 --> 08:50 I want to get started, I want to— my dream is to have this device
08:50 --> 08:53 do this. What's that process like? I think the
08:54 --> 08:57 first part of the process is to have them come in and
08:57 --> 09:00 kind of just have the discussion with us and just kind of go into detail
09:01 --> 09:05 about what their dream is, what the requirements are, um, kind of like the real-world
09:05 --> 09:08 struggles they're dealing with. 'Cause a lot of 'em are surgeons who,
09:09 --> 09:12 in all honesty, a lot of the surgical techniques and instruments they're
09:12 --> 09:15 dealing with are, are kind of archaic at this point. And a lot of 'em
09:16 --> 09:19 haven't had any upgrades or any development on 'em for a while. So a lot
09:20 --> 09:24 of 'em come to us with these ideas and we kind of try to understand
09:25 --> 09:28 the requirements and kind of their pain points and then where do they want to
09:28 --> 09:33 go with it. Um, and then really we just kind of help them with
09:33 --> 09:37 our, like, experience that we've had, bring either
09:37 --> 09:41 their idea to life or kind of help, help show them what's possible and,
09:41 --> 09:45 and what's possible to kind of help bring their device to market. How often is
09:45 --> 09:49 that first, like, step prototype
09:49 --> 09:52 until when it can be legally used?
09:52 --> 09:56 Is that— are there a lot of steps along the way? And how often does
09:56 --> 10:00 it happen where it's not it's not feasible to be able to do that project
10:01 --> 10:06 anymore? Um, I think a lot of it just depends on— a lot
10:06 --> 10:09 of it's financing, honestly, that kind of defines how quickly we can do it.
10:09 --> 10:12 We have a very large team, we have a lot of engineers, we're growing every
10:12 --> 10:16 day. Um, we really can drive it
10:16 --> 10:19 pretty quickly. Um, it just depends on
10:20 --> 10:23 how many of us you want on it and the direction you want to go.
10:24 --> 10:27 And then it also depends on what's out there on the market that's similar to
10:27 --> 10:30 it. It gets a lot more complicated if there's nothing on the market
10:30 --> 10:32 that we can use as kind of a predicate or a baseline showing like,
10:32 --> 10:36 hey, this has kind of been done before, so there's a precedence for it
10:37 --> 10:40 to move it forward. If it's never been done, you got to do a lot
10:40 --> 10:43 more, a lot more clinical trials, a lot more— I didn't even think of
10:43 --> 10:47 that. I was thinking the opposite, like it would be— if you're the first ones
10:47 --> 10:50 to do it, it would be easier for you to get through, right? But I
10:50 --> 10:53 guess in So, so that's, that's worth explaining here. This is a cool thing just
10:54 --> 10:58 for people to learn. You know, when you go and have surgery, everything that's
10:58 --> 11:01 in there has rather old enough that it was grandfathered in,
11:01 --> 11:05 so it had been used a lot, or the process that the FDA
11:05 --> 11:09 requires is called a 510 submission. And what you're doing in that
11:09 --> 11:13 is proving substantial equivalence to something else. So whatever indications
11:13 --> 11:17 that they want to use, they have to go in and say,
11:17 --> 11:20 here's our device that we're coming with, it has the same indications as this,
11:20 --> 11:23 it's kind of the same form factor, it may have some things that improve it,
11:23 --> 11:27 but based on testing, it has to perform better than something that's already
11:27 --> 11:30 on the market. So you can feel pretty secure if you're going in and you're
11:31 --> 11:35 getting something that's approved. It's been tested rigorously. So when you see someone
11:35 --> 11:39 coming in with a new idea, a brand new idea, it's like, oh no,
11:39 --> 11:42 like this is gonna be an uphill climb that we have to try to get
11:43 --> 11:45 through. Well, we're actually pretty excited about it most of the time. Like we,
11:45 --> 11:49 we have ones coming all the time and they're very unique and novel ideas,
11:49 --> 11:52 and it's exciting. And I think our main point is to kind of get to
11:53 --> 11:56 the level where we've kind of defined whether
11:56 --> 11:59 it's plausible or not as quickly as possible. We don't want to, we don't want
12:00 --> 12:02 to get in there and waste a ton of their time and money. We kind
12:03 --> 12:05 of get in there, we do our initial research, see what else is out there
12:05 --> 12:08 that's similar to it. We really dive in, we do some mathematics, we do some
12:09 --> 12:12 comparison, we do some initial prototyping, testing, and just
12:12 --> 12:16 kind of see, hey, is this, is this even possible to do? From our perspective.
12:17 --> 12:20 And if it is, then we'll say, hey, here's the next point,
12:20 --> 12:24 here's the next steps, um, and we can drive it forward.
12:24 --> 12:28 And, and we're just really upfront with people on kind of
12:28 --> 12:31 like, hey, there's nothing out there like this. Or once we get it to a
12:32 --> 12:34 certain point, we look at the patents that are already out there and say,
12:34 --> 12:37 hey, this would be infringing on this patent or that patent, um,
12:38 --> 12:40 we would have to adjust it this way or that in order to be able
12:40 --> 12:44 to kind of to move forward with this product. But we've
12:44 --> 12:47 had a lot of people come with us with just these really cool ideas that
12:47 --> 12:50 we're just excited to, to just solve
12:51 --> 12:54 the problem. We're problem solvers in reality, and product development is just our passion.
12:55 --> 12:59 And the cool thing about being brought up in medical devices,
12:59 --> 13:01 because I started as an intern at this other company,
13:02 --> 13:05 and coming up through and learning the process,
13:05 --> 13:09 medical devices is cool because there's just enough oversight
13:09 --> 13:13 from the FDA, that you have to have a process in place. But the projects
13:13 --> 13:16 are small enough that we iterate a lot. Like, you can go through a project—
13:16 --> 13:20 you asked the question earlier, how long. In our world, we can get
13:20 --> 13:24 something from napkin sketch to approved in surgery in 12 to
13:24 --> 13:28 18 months. Whereas the big companies, because they have so much bureaucracy
13:28 --> 13:30 and so many signatures that have to go on everything and it has to go
13:31 --> 13:34 through all these different departments, they're looking at 3 to 5 years to
13:34 --> 13:38 release something new. And I think so Sorry. Oh, and so the big companies,
13:38 --> 13:41 their, their strategy is actually let the little guys innovate and then
13:42 --> 13:45 they scoop 'em up once they've got marketable products. I think the amazing
13:45 --> 13:49 part about our, like, kind of company in general is
13:49 --> 13:53 that we have everything from the beginning. We have the whole,
13:53 --> 13:57 every single path step in the pathway down. So we have our mechanical
13:58 --> 14:02 engineers that can design it up. We have our quality regulatory that can,
14:02 --> 14:05 from the beginning, be involved with every step as we're doing that to
14:05 --> 14:09 kind of help delete some of those obstacles of regulatory obstacles
14:10 --> 14:13 in the future. And then we have our prototype machine shop like literally outside of
14:14 --> 14:17 our door. Most places you can't just walk right out and say,
14:17 --> 14:20 hey, to, to a machinist with decades worth of experience
14:21 --> 14:24 and just say, hey, can you review my drawing? This, this is a very initial
14:25 --> 14:27 stage. What's manufacturable about this? What,
14:28 --> 14:31 what isn't? What can I change? What can I adjust? Most people design it all
14:32 --> 14:35 out. And then they send it off to a manufacturer that they don't know how
14:35 --> 14:39 much they're going to review it. They don't have as much experience with
14:39 --> 14:42 who these manufacturers are, their background in the mechanical or
14:43 --> 14:47 the manufacturing review process. So we can, we can have that manufacturing
14:47 --> 14:51 review almost from day one because our, our machinists are
14:51 --> 14:55 literally right out the door and willing to sit down with us any time and
14:55 --> 14:58 walk through what's possible machine-wise. So it sounds like the,
14:59 --> 15:02 the 2 areas that are just so beneficial to someone that's
15:02 --> 15:06 coming in with an idea is the white glove service and then
15:06 --> 15:10 the, the speed which you guys can, can work with this, right?
15:10 --> 15:14 So yeah, um, I mean, I, I would, I would think that
15:14 --> 15:18 gets that person so excited because
15:18 --> 15:22 they're like, this, this actually can come to fruition in less than a year if
15:22 --> 15:25 everything goes right. Yeah, well, and, and really we, we approach it
15:26 --> 15:29 from this cost strategy because I, I want, I want to make sure you understand
15:29 --> 15:33 We really work with those people that come in. We have kind of 3 ways
15:34 --> 15:37 of doing it. They can pay for just hourly because sometimes they're further down the
15:37 --> 15:40 path or they just need some advice and we'll just, we'll just charge an hourly
15:41 --> 15:44 rate. Then we do a rate that's like for a project, like if they sign
15:44 --> 15:47 up for a certain amount of work, we give them a discount off of our
15:47 --> 15:51 hourly rate. So that's 2 ways. And then if we get far enough
15:51 --> 15:54 down the path that usually there's a proof of concept, if it's something for us,
15:54 --> 15:57 we'll actually invest by even cutting our rate further. As long as
15:58 --> 16:01 we get equity in what they're doing. And for us, that's, that's where we've taken
16:01 --> 16:03 it from just being a contract engineering company to saying,
16:04 --> 16:08 hey, we, we want— when we find good ideas, we want to help you make
16:08 --> 16:11 it as streamlined as possible to get to launch. Yeah, yeah. And I think it's
16:11 --> 16:15 also a way to show that we believe in their product and ourselves just like
16:16 --> 16:19 just as much as they do. Yeah, we're passionate about it and we care and
16:19 --> 16:22 we want to step in and we're like, hey, we care enough that we actually
16:23 --> 16:25 we want to put some skin in the game to show you that we care
16:25 --> 16:28 that much. We want to be there for you. We want to drive this forward.
16:28 --> 16:31 And the more that, that we progress with some of these ideas,
16:31 --> 16:35 they're just so, so amazing. Some of these ideas these surgeons or doctors
16:35 --> 16:38 have come up with are— well, they're the front line, right? They're the ones doing
16:38 --> 16:41 surgery every day. Yeah. And so that just really kind of,
16:41 --> 16:44 I feel, to them as well shows that, hey, we care.
16:44 --> 16:48 We're also helping out with like the finance side, and we can also help find,
16:48 --> 16:52 um, some investors and stuff like that as well if depending on the pathway and
16:53 --> 16:56 depending on the complication, the complexity of the project, we can help find
16:57 --> 17:00 investors and build it out as well that way. And I want to tell you
17:00 --> 17:04 one more thing, Jet, that you asked a question earlier because I just, I just
17:04 --> 17:08 walked you through like how they pay. But really, Micah said that
17:08 --> 17:11 we have a really defined path. It's actually broken into 3 phases. Phase 1 is
17:12 --> 17:15 discovery. Phase 2 is, is like developing
17:15 --> 17:19 and the iterating. And then the last phase is verification and validation.
17:19 --> 17:22 So a lot of our first, like if somebody comes with just an idea,
17:22 --> 17:25 we usually encourage them to do what we call a Phase 1+. So we do
17:26 --> 17:28 a lot of the paperwork and a lot of the discovery in the first to
17:29 --> 17:32 make sure we understand the problem, understand the user needs. And then we call
17:33 --> 17:35 it Phase 1+ because we're going to go far enough, just far enough to get
17:35 --> 17:38 a proof of concept. Because if we can get a proof of concept, then we
17:38 --> 17:41 can say, okay, we think it's going to take 3 more rounds of iterating and
17:42 --> 17:44 we can be at design freeze. And design freeze is the end of that Phase
17:44 --> 17:47 2, which allows you to go to, now we got to build a few of
17:47 --> 17:50 these. We got to do all the testing that we have to do, and then
17:50 --> 17:54 that regulatory piece. But like Micah said, we start thinking about regulatory
17:54 --> 17:57 clear back in phase 1 just so it's smooth when it comes into there.
17:57 --> 18:00 And there's a lot of opportunities in there if you understand the process and you
18:00 --> 18:03 understand the risks. You can take risks along the way, and this is
18:04 --> 18:07 for product development, anybody, not just medical devices, like building
18:07 --> 18:11 things in parallel with some testing if you have confidence in certain aspects of
18:12 --> 18:15 the project, which can speed up the whole thing. Yeah, you know, You brought a
18:16 --> 18:19 point like they, they get to you, you can foresee this
18:19 --> 18:21 path early on.
18:22 --> 18:25 What about those people that get to you later on? What's, what's,
18:26 --> 18:29 what are examples that you guys can think of that have cost them
18:29 --> 18:33 because they didn't get to you at the, at the beginning idea
18:34 --> 18:36 and now they're just like, hey, I'm like, I think I'm halfway through it,
18:36 --> 18:40 but there's a lot of pieces that are missing. I have an example
18:40 --> 18:43 of that, a perfect one. So I was working on a total ankle project that
18:44 --> 18:46 came to us. This was at a previous company, but this is a good example
18:47 --> 18:49 of it. They had been spinning their wheels for a year and a half on
18:49 --> 18:52 a design that they were basically deforming a piece of metal
18:53 --> 18:56 to kind of create a lockout. And we took one look at
18:56 --> 18:59 that and said, that's never going to work. Like, you're going to have problems.
19:00 --> 19:04 So in less than 3 months, a couple of brainstorming sessions with us and working,
19:04 --> 19:07 we had a new patent for them and they'd solved their problem.
19:07 --> 19:11 And then they launched that probably 8 months later after they'd
19:11 --> 19:14 spent a year and a half spinning their wheels with a couple of other engineering
19:14 --> 19:18 groups trying to figure it out. But it's just the know-how that came. And,
19:18 --> 19:21 and I don't give myself credit for that. Like, I was a pretty young engineer
19:21 --> 19:24 at that point. But the cool thing that I learned in there and that we're
19:25 --> 19:28 continuing to do with Lifestyle Medical is that when there's a really tough challenge— so
19:28 --> 19:32 you say somebody comes to us and they're— they've got a roadblock, we actually
19:32 --> 19:35 love— we thrive on that because we'll take it and sit down with 10 of
19:36 --> 19:39 our engineers in a room and say, here's the problem, know just enough, now give
19:39 --> 19:42 us some brainstorming. And we'll come up with like 6 or 7 unique ideas there.
19:43 --> 19:46 And actually in that situation I was telling you with the total ankle,
19:47 --> 19:50 it wasn't one exact idea. It was actually 2 ideas
19:50 --> 19:53 from 2 different engineers that I ended up combining. I was riding my bike home
19:53 --> 19:56 from work and it came to me like, why couldn't I do both of those?
19:57 --> 20:00 And that's what solved their problem for them. So we actually,
20:01 --> 20:03 we like to start from ground zero cuz we know we can run an efficient
20:03 --> 20:07 process, but we're not afraid for somebody that's had a problem to come to
20:07 --> 20:10 us because between myself and 3 of the other leadership team members,
20:10 --> 20:14 we have 35, 40 years of experience
20:14 --> 20:17 solving these really hard problems, and we bounce ideas off each other,
20:17 --> 20:21 and we're going to come up with something good. And I'm guessing as time
20:21 --> 20:26 goes on and you, you guys keep working with building
20:26 --> 20:29 new technology and, and getting more experience in that,
20:30 --> 20:33 it just becomes— does it feel like it's easier? Oh yeah, at that point,
20:34 --> 20:36 like, you're just like, yeah, we've seen enough of this that we can just start
20:37 --> 20:39 to theory. Well, and it plays to Micah's point that he made earlier.
20:40 --> 20:44 We can see really good ideas. Like, we love to talk with people.
20:44 --> 20:47 We have a screening process. We actually have a thing that, that we
20:48 --> 20:50 go through if we want to invest in something like we'll take any project and
20:51 --> 20:53 we believe in it. If they've seen a problem, we're willing to tackle it,
20:53 --> 20:56 do a Phase 1+, see if we can get to proof of concept. But at
20:56 --> 20:59 that moment, we run it through and if it makes sense, we're going to
21:00 --> 21:02 pursue that other idea and we're going to say, hey, we'll give you an extra
21:03 --> 21:06 20% off your engineering if you let us have, you know, a percentage of what
21:07 --> 21:10 you're doing. So we can, we can be really bought into this. Yeah.
21:10 --> 21:14 I'm curious, what has been, uh, an example of
21:14 --> 21:18 the maybe an obstacle or hurdle that was just like,
21:19 --> 21:21 man, you guys were like, this might not work out, and then you went,
21:22 --> 21:25 kind of broke through and got through it? Can you think of an instance
21:25 --> 21:29 that happened? Yeah, I think every project usually has
21:29 --> 21:32 an aspect of that if I get thinking about it honestly.
21:33 --> 21:36 Um, we've got one that we're working on right now that's still pretty raw,
21:36 --> 21:39 and we're working on the patent, so I can't give too many details. But it
21:39 --> 21:42 was essentially a surgeon came to us with an idea that they,
21:43 --> 21:46 they wanted to make something in their life easier. They wanted to be able to
21:46 --> 21:50 integrate the instrument and the implant all in one.
21:51 --> 21:54 Pretty fancy instrument. And we started pursuing down that
21:54 --> 21:57 path, and we got down there a little bit, and it's like, this is not
21:57 --> 22:00 progressing as fast as I want. Can we break it into 2 instruments to
22:00 --> 22:04 start with? And we're like, okay. So then we go back, iterate, get one instrument
22:05 --> 22:07 that works perfect, the other instrument that works perfect. And now we're like, oh,
22:07 --> 22:11 these actually can be together. But you had to break out the different pieces of
22:11 --> 22:15 it first and then be able to bring those back together. So now I see
22:16 --> 22:19 a world where that project's going to go forward because we took enough
22:20 --> 22:22 time to separate the 2 pieces, figure it out, and now bring it back together.
22:22 --> 22:26 Does that— looking back on it now, does that feel simple that
22:27 --> 22:29 you were just like, I just needed to separate that? Or do you think that's
22:30 --> 22:33 such a— it was so in your face that you couldn't see
22:34 --> 22:37 it because you were trying to just make this one? Well, and honestly, that's what
22:37 --> 22:40 happened because the— I wasn't the engineer doing the work on it, but I was
22:40 --> 22:44 overseeing the project. And they, they came with a frustration like, I don't
22:44 --> 22:46 know if I can do this, or I'm not making the progress that I want.
22:46 --> 22:48 So I was able to look at it and say, wait a minute, what if
22:49 --> 22:51 we just take this only one piece first, and now we'll do this piece?
22:51 --> 22:54 And now, now that we've developed both of those, now you say, oh, there's no
22:54 --> 22:57 reason this can't be together. But we couldn't see it when it was separate.
22:57 --> 23:01 Yeah, and I think a lot of that just comes to just almost being
23:01 --> 23:05 overwhelmed as an engineer because you're looking at this ginormous problem.
23:05 --> 23:09 You're seeing multiple instruments that's combined into one
23:09 --> 23:13 and trying to figure out how to make everything interact without being clunky or overbearing.
23:13 --> 23:16 And I think kind of when we broke it down to some more
23:16 --> 23:19 simplicity and starting at the basics, um,
23:20 --> 23:23 we kind of have a saying here that it's like, make it work and then
23:24 --> 23:26 make it beautiful. And I think that's kind of what we did here is like,
23:26 --> 23:30 okay, we made them work individually. Um, and then in
23:30 --> 23:34 all honesty, that then it just kind of clicked together because every aspect,
23:34 --> 23:38 like, um, the, the implant and then the device and
23:38 --> 23:42 then just kind of everything kind of just kind of fell together. And it just
23:42 --> 23:46 was almost, it was just so cool to see like each individual component all of
23:46 --> 23:48 a sudden it clicks like, oh, if we do this, then we can do this,
23:48 --> 23:52 then we can do this. And then we can just everything will work so seamless—
23:53 --> 23:57 seamlessly. What, what's the celebration like when that happens? Are you guys, are you
23:57 --> 24:00 guys just kicking open doors? I just pictured you guys, especially Zach,
24:01 --> 24:04 like coming through a door and just screaming. Yeah, just screaming through
24:04 --> 24:08 the whole entire building. Like, is that— there is. Yeah, there's definitely, there's definitely
24:08 --> 24:12 moments. High fives are a big thing in our office. Like, there's definitely shared
24:13 --> 24:16 wins. And in the same breath, we probably don't celebrate some of the cool stuff
24:16 --> 24:19 we've done enough because it's on to the next one, right? It's just kind of
24:20 --> 24:22 that I told you before, hunger is a big thing for us. I think the
24:23 --> 24:27 people that we've brought in, there's an innate hunger. So you solve a problem,
24:27 --> 24:30 but you realize that the joy is in the journey, not necessarily in solving the
24:31 --> 24:34 problem. It's the journey of it. And as soon as that one's solved, you're onto
24:34 --> 24:36 the next one. Cause you're going to get the joy as you go along.
24:37 --> 24:40 Yeah. I'm sure there's, there's devices that you guys have worked on and finished and
24:41 --> 24:44 look back and go, man, that was, that's actually life-moving or life-changing.
24:45 --> 24:48 Right. And probably didn't celebrate. Well, it is life-changing. So let's go full circle with
24:48 --> 24:49 the story I told you before about the total ankle, that total ankle goes in.
24:51 --> 24:54 300 or 400 people every year, even today, that I worked
24:55 --> 24:58 on 10 years ago. So it's so satisfying to know that you
24:59 --> 25:02 touched something that, one, made the surgeon's life easier, two,
25:03 --> 25:06 maybe made all the sales rep and like staff— it's
25:06 --> 25:10 easier because if it's streamlined anything, it's good. And then ultimately
25:10 --> 25:13 it's the patient. It's all about the patient in medical devices. That's what I think
25:14 --> 25:17 is cool. Like a lot of engineering fields, you can be working on, you know,
25:17 --> 25:20 building bombs or building tall buildings or all
25:20 --> 25:23 sorts of stuff. But for me, it's like in the end of the day,
25:23 --> 25:28 we're rather extending somebody's life or improving their day-to-day
25:28 --> 25:32 abilities, like how much pain they feel. Like, all of that is just
25:33 --> 25:36 a cool thing to be involved in. I've, I found a lot of fulfillment from
25:36 --> 25:39 that little tablecloth table that I sat down and found out that, oh, I can
25:39 --> 25:43 work on some implants, you know, like, uh, knees and
25:43 --> 25:46 hips and shoulders and ankles. It's fun.
25:46 --> 25:49 Yeah, it is really fulfilling just to kind of see when your products go into
25:49 --> 25:52 somebody and just kind of like, hey, this is I know it's safe, I know
25:53 --> 25:56 it's effective, I know it's better than what was out there before. And I think
25:56 --> 26:00 the biggest focus now is like these minimally invasive surgeries, just because a
26:01 --> 26:04 lot of the current surgeries that a lot of patients can't have because they're too
26:04 --> 26:09 high of risk for, for these huge open surgeries, that it's
26:09 --> 26:13 just unsafe. Like, people won't— complications. Yeah, complications are too high,
26:13 --> 26:16 so the surgeons won't perform them on these patients. And by,
26:16 --> 26:20 by some of the projects we've done and kind pushing towards
26:20 --> 26:23 more of a minimally invasive surgery,
26:23 --> 26:27 then we're able to, to really do surgeries on
26:27 --> 26:31 people who never would have qualified for it before because they can heal so much
26:32 --> 26:35 quicker. You're really disrupting the surgery, the, the site and the tissue
26:35 --> 26:38 and the skin so much less, and it just leads
26:39 --> 26:43 to a lot less pain, a lot quicker recovery. And it's just, it's, it's amazing
26:43 --> 26:46 to kind of just know that you're affecting people's lives who,
26:47 --> 26:50 who never would have been able to have these surgeries before. Working in orthopedics
26:51 --> 26:53 is cool because the bones actually heal pretty fast and then it's not that painful.
26:53 --> 26:56 It's all the soft tissue around it. But being able to work through a little
26:57 --> 27:01 like couple centimeter incision versus a whole open surgery, it's— it
27:01 --> 27:05 changes the game. And it's exciting. I wish you guys could like
27:05 --> 27:09 view this as like cars. Like you can drive down a road one day and
27:09 --> 27:12 just like, hey, that's us. You know, like that would be so cool. Like it's,
27:13 --> 27:16 it's part of it. Like I— it, it feels like it's
27:16 --> 27:20 this hidden, you know, aspect of it where you never really get to
27:20 --> 27:23 go, oh, that, that person walking around, that's us, right? I can't see that.
27:24 --> 27:27 Yeah, like everyone has like a, like a necklace that's walking around, go, that's,
27:28 --> 27:31 we, that's our medical device that we worked on, you know. And so curious,
27:31 --> 27:35 but maybe it's actually better not to. Yeah, that you're, that you're,
27:36 --> 27:40 you're just knowing that you're helping humanity in general. And if, because there's,
27:40 --> 27:42 you know, we've done, we've worked on things like a hip and there's lots of
27:43 --> 27:47 other hips out there, but in general, we're all pushing each other to higher heights
27:47 --> 27:50 of innovation, right? So if anybody's getting a hip surgery and I'm working
27:51 --> 27:54 on a hip device, it's like you get satisfaction from knowing that you're pushing the
27:54 --> 27:57 envelope, making sure that we're heading the right direction. Yeah.
27:57 --> 28:01 What do you think would be one of the things that surprises a client
28:02 --> 28:05 coming in that they would never have thought of if they were trying to develop
28:06 --> 28:10 a device? I think one of the biggest
28:10 --> 28:14 things is, is a lot of people think, hey, the mechanical development
28:15 --> 28:19 or the design of it, the bringing it to a functional prototype
28:19 --> 28:23 that works beautifully, then you're done. But the thing is that
28:23 --> 28:26 there's so much more after that as far as the quality regulatory work and making
28:26 --> 28:30 sure that it not only works, but that you can actually manufacture it consistently,
28:31 --> 28:34 it's safe, you're anticipating all
28:34 --> 28:38 of the risks or misuses that the surgeon or whoever's using the device
28:39 --> 28:42 can even contemplate doing. You have to anticipate, is this
28:42 --> 28:46 person going to stick this somewhere that they shouldn't? Yeah. Um, and, and how do
28:46 --> 28:50 we mitigate that risk? And, and all of that documentation and validation and verification
28:51 --> 28:54 and stuff that happens along the process after you kind
28:54 --> 28:58 of have a functional prototype or a functional device. I think that's, that's a lot
28:59 --> 29:03 bigger, um, I think, of a portion of the design and development process
29:03 --> 29:06 than a lot of people think. I would say one thing too. So we
29:07 --> 29:10 have a surgeon right now that he said a little quote recently that
29:11 --> 29:14 I really liked. He's actually been a design surgeon with other groups before.
29:14 --> 29:17 And he's, and he's had some good innovative ideas. He's got things that are on
29:17 --> 29:20 the market that have really made an impact. He said
29:21 --> 29:24 that as he's worked with other groups, he said, I will tell them ideas and
29:24 --> 29:28 they'll make my idea. When he's worked with Lifestyle Medical, he said,
29:29 --> 29:32 I bring an idea and they give it back to me even better than my
29:33 --> 29:36 idea was. And so that to me meant a lot.
29:37 --> 29:40 And I think the thing that a surgeon or a sales rep might underestimate is
29:40 --> 29:42 how much input they give along the way.
29:44 --> 29:47 Like I told you earlier, one of our first steps is defining user needs.
29:48 --> 29:52 We really want to understand what is the user need for the
29:52 --> 29:54 surgeon and what is it for the patient. And we list those all out and
29:55 --> 29:57 then we make design inputs that go for every single one of those to make
29:58 --> 30:01 sure that we have something measurable to say that we accomplished that.
30:02 --> 30:05 And then as we iterate, I think surgeons don't realize that they're going to have
30:06 --> 30:08 so much input. And the best surgeons are the ones that we get to sit
30:08 --> 30:12 down with on a normal basis and show our feedback and show our progress.
30:13 --> 30:16 And they give feedback every single time. And it becomes a better product because we
30:16 --> 30:19 get that frontline feedback as we go. So that's the thing that
30:19 --> 30:22 maybe they underestimate is I got a good idea.
30:22 --> 30:24 They think they're going to just throw it over the fence and then it just
30:25 --> 30:27 comes back. What they don't realize is that they actually get to be part of
30:27 --> 30:31 the development and they're key to how fast it goes. And we're really
30:31 --> 30:35 good at innovation and design and coming up with amazing concepts,
30:37 --> 30:40 but we're never in the OR. Yeah, we're never,
30:40 --> 30:43 we're never performing the surgeries. And I think some of the best feedback
30:44 --> 30:47 we get from some of the surgeons is actually when we do a cadaver lab
30:48 --> 30:51 and we get to put our, put our implant and test
30:51 --> 30:55 it on in the real world, kind of. And those surgeons most of the time
30:55 --> 30:59 are there performing those surgeries and giving us feedback
30:59 --> 31:03 right then. And then we write that down, we go through, we iterate
31:04 --> 31:07 according to their feedback, and then it's on to the next cadaver lab where they
31:07 --> 31:10 can test it again and say, oh wow, that's a lot better. That's the ergonomics
31:11 --> 31:14 of this handle are really comfortable. This ratchet is really really smooth.
31:14 --> 31:18 This is exactly— this works well. This is what I would want
31:19 --> 31:23 performing surgeries. And some of them are performing a lot of surgeries per day,
31:23 --> 31:26 and if they can cut down that time or make it more comfortable,
31:27 --> 31:31 it's just going to end up being better for the patients and the surgeon in
31:31 --> 31:35 general. How often does that happen for devices that you
31:35 --> 31:39 guys are done, everything's finished, it goes out into the real world, and then
31:41 --> 31:44 later that it— there needs to be an adjustment. How often
31:45 --> 31:47 does that happen, or does it become a whole new— well, a lot of times
31:48 --> 31:51 it'll become a device. There's some different regulatory pathways to make updates. It depends on
31:51 --> 31:54 how substantial the update is. But I'd actually
31:54 --> 31:56 answer your question with almost always, which is good.
31:57 --> 32:02 We like to be able to say, what is the— going
32:02 --> 32:06 back to what Micah said before, one of the— one of our things is,
32:06 --> 32:08 would you use this on your grandma? We ask ourselves that,
32:08 --> 32:12 like, as I'm building something, is this safe and effective enough that
32:12 --> 32:14 I would use it on my grandma? And once the answer is yes, I want
32:15 --> 32:17 to get it out in surgeons' hands and get it out in the field.
32:17 --> 32:20 And almost always those come back and there's a version 2, a version 3,
32:20 --> 32:25 which is totally okay. Because if you try and push to version 7 without
32:25 --> 32:28 ever releasing version 1, you'll never get to 7.
32:29 --> 32:32 So in our mind, there's pathways to maybe minimize what
32:32 --> 32:35 you have to do for a, for a change depending on how substantial it is.
32:35 --> 32:38 But it's actually good if you get that feedback. That means that a surgeon's using
32:38 --> 32:41 it and they're noticing something that could be better. Yeah, and a lot of
32:42 --> 32:46 times we prefer to have multiple surgeons testing the instruments as it goes because every
32:46 --> 32:50 surgeon has, has their preference. Like, we're, we're in a cadaver lab
32:50 --> 32:52 and one of the surgeons is like, well, I want a burr to cut through
32:52 --> 32:55 this, this bone, and I want a saw. The other one says they want a
32:56 --> 32:59 saw. And so, but our, our jig is only set up for
32:59 --> 33:03 one or the other, and so we can then iterate
33:03 --> 33:06 at that point and be like, oh, we can make one for both. But there's
33:06 --> 33:10 every, every surgeon has their preference out there, and obviously you can't accommodate every
33:10 --> 33:13 single one of them. But we, we tend to get that feedback, um,
33:14 --> 33:17 kind of in, in our complaint handling process and
33:18 --> 33:21 kind of in the back end, uh, our feedback from other surgeons or doctors
33:22 --> 33:25 as what they would prefer to have made better. And then we
33:26 --> 33:30 can kind of iterate and make another, another version to
33:30 --> 33:33 kind of accommodate if the world's asking for it, let's give it to them.
33:34 --> 33:38 Is there— oh, is there ever— I mean, or I should rather ask, how often
33:39 --> 33:43 is the discussion between, uh, speed of the process to get
33:43 --> 33:47 it made against quality, right? I'm assuming you guys,
33:47 --> 33:50 it's always quality first because that's where we need to be able to get it
33:50 --> 33:54 out there, get— make sure it's safe for everyone to use and meets the regulations.
33:54 --> 33:58 But do you get a lot of clients that are just like I want this
33:59 --> 34:01 out in like 6 months. And you're like, that's not reality, you know?
34:03 --> 34:05 Yeah, we're honest with them, like based on our experience. We're not afraid to tell
34:05 --> 34:08 them that this is how long it's gonna take. And I, I quoted a project
34:09 --> 34:12 not that long ago that for some reason,
34:13 --> 34:16 their mindset was this is only gonna take this much dollars and this
34:17 --> 34:19 much time. And I gave them a quote on what it was gonna look like,
34:19 --> 34:22 and they're like, are you sure? And I'm like, yes, I am sure. I've done
34:23 --> 34:27 it you know, 20 times. So I know. And so they weren't the right customer.
34:27 --> 34:30 Yeah. So I guess he might go and knock a few more doors and maybe
34:31 --> 34:34 he'll circle back around. At least he has our proposal in hand. So yes,
34:34 --> 34:37 to that point, I think we're always honest and upfront with our customers. Like,
34:37 --> 34:41 we've seen the process, and then there's times when it's maybe pushing the boundary that
34:41 --> 34:44 we'll, we'll be clear with them. We don't know. We think it's going to take
34:44 --> 34:47 3 rounds of iteration, but it might take a 4th. Because I, I think for
34:48 --> 34:51 what you guys do, it's finding the synergy between you and
34:52 --> 34:55 the client is important, right? Because they have to understand that it's
34:55 --> 34:58 not just like, I'm gonna make this device, it's gonna make me a million bucks
34:59 --> 35:01 or whatever it is, and then, and, and then it just needs to be done.
35:01 --> 35:05 You guys have to find— make sure that you're finding that those steps and
35:05 --> 35:08 make sure it's done correctly. Um, how has, uh,
35:09 --> 35:12 AI helped you guys or changed the business
35:12 --> 35:15 as time has gone on? A lot.
35:15 --> 35:18 Yeah, I think it's been a big factor.
35:18 --> 35:22 Um, so like, I— let's, let's back up to like FDA regulations.
35:22 --> 35:25 I mean, they have everything well documented. Like there's, there's,
35:26 --> 35:29 uh, clear definitions of almost everything, but it's really hard to keep all of
35:29 --> 35:33 that at the forefront. So AI has been able to— we've been able to make,
35:33 --> 35:37 um, programs that take all that into account and do some final review
35:37 --> 35:40 for us. So we always still have people running it. But it's more
35:40 --> 35:44 like double-checking and looking for opportunities just, just to make
35:45 --> 35:48 sure that we're meeting the regulations and following what's out there. So it's
35:48 --> 35:51 been powerful that way. It's like there's 60,
35:51 --> 35:55 70, 80-page documents, and I don't know if any engineer has time to read every
35:56 --> 35:59 single word, every single project, right? So it's, it's really
35:59 --> 36:03 been eye-opening to me that you can be able to summarize things
36:03 --> 36:06 and then be able to review things and just make a better product in the
36:06 --> 36:10 end. Were you guys always working with AI when
36:10 --> 36:13 the business started? No, it was— no, we've seen it evolve.
36:14 --> 36:17 Yeah, definitely. As we've— as we started, what was the process like prior
36:18 --> 36:21 to AI? You just had to have— usually you were required
36:22 --> 36:25 to have somebody on your team that knew it really, really well, which was good.
36:25 --> 36:28 As we started, we knew that quality regulatory was something important for us.
36:28 --> 36:33 So actually, our kind of our godfather of Lifestyle Medical,
36:33 --> 36:37 um, he had 35 years of quality regulatory experience. And so
36:37 --> 36:41 that was how we differentiate our from day one as we started our engineering group,
36:41 --> 36:44 we knew we wanted to have that capability. We didn't just want to— there's lots
36:45 --> 36:48 of design houses that'll only do like that phase 1, maybe into phase 2,
36:49 --> 36:51 but they're not looking to help get it all the way to the finish line.
36:52 --> 36:55 So, for us, that was important, but we were lucky enough that we
36:56 --> 36:59 found our now director of quality
37:00 --> 37:03 regulatory. He ended up having a couple internships that were really insightful
37:03 --> 37:06 for him, saw a lot of the backend processes of what we do,
37:07 --> 37:10 And we just challenged him to say, hey, we need somebody to step up.
37:10 --> 37:13 And he's been able to couple that with AI. You know,
37:13 --> 37:17 now he's been there and seeing how things go together and just
37:17 --> 37:20 knocking it out of the park. That's awesome. As we're wrapping up,
37:20 --> 37:24 I want to ask you guys if you can go back to your
37:24 --> 37:28 beginning entrepreneur selves and give yourself advice that
37:28 --> 37:32 might expedite this journey, some piece of advice
37:32 --> 37:35 would be like, this is going to change your life if you do this in
37:35 --> 37:38 the beginning here. What would it be? I, I think we already
37:38 --> 37:41 did it pretty well, and it's something that's— it's, it's about
37:42 --> 37:44 finding the right people, and I feel like we've done that in this group.
37:45 --> 37:47 Um, I,
37:50 --> 37:52 I don't know, I think just having more confidence, I guess, from the beginning too,
37:52 --> 37:55 that it's, it's possible and you can push yourself to, to get it
37:55 --> 37:59 done and just be— that you're capable to, to do something that
38:00 --> 38:03 just seems so over-the-top overwhelming to to really just bring something
38:04 --> 38:07 to fruition that seems so grandiose. Yeah.
38:08 --> 38:10 And mine's people-related too. Find good mentors.
38:11 --> 38:15 I think one of the keys for me is that the second we
38:15 --> 38:18 decided to start Lifestyle Medical, I found a couple of people I found through the
38:18 --> 38:21 SCORE program. That's a good place to find kind of a mentor.
38:22 --> 38:25 And then, here locally, I found another business owner that runs
38:26 --> 38:29 a company that is bigger than ours. And that's how I say you always do
38:29 --> 38:32 time travel. How do you time travel? You find somebody that's 25 years farther down
38:33 --> 38:36 the road and then you ask them. Yeah. So, so I don't know if that
38:37 --> 38:39 would be the advice that I would give to me then, because that's the advice
38:40 --> 38:42 I took, right? Like, I don't know if it'd be any different. Somewhere along the
38:43 --> 38:46 way, I determined that between the people that you actually meet with, like live mentors,
38:46 --> 38:50 or ones that you meet virtually and you talk with them, or even just the
38:50 --> 38:53 books I've read, like that just being a reader— readers are
38:54 --> 38:57 leaders. Like, if you can take into a lot of different
38:58 --> 39:02 perspectives and just kind of decide what's good, what's not, It seems
39:02 --> 39:05 like the right advice comes at the right moment, but you got to be open
39:05 --> 39:08 to it. You got to be willing to make changes. And, and that's the fun
39:08 --> 39:12 part about entrepreneurship is the pivot. If you think you
39:12 --> 39:15 have the perfect idea, work on it for a month and you'll realize that there's
39:15 --> 39:17 got to be tweaks to it if it's going to work. I always find that
39:18 --> 39:21 the best entrepreneurs are the ones that are able to adjust and pivot
39:21 --> 39:25 when things get, get hairy. You know, they look at it straight in the face
39:25 --> 39:29 and go, okay, I'm just making an adjustment and do it. And It's never easy
39:29 --> 39:31 because I think the ego gets involved in it. Oh yeah, we all want to
39:32 --> 39:34 do it a certain way, and then we're like, we're gonna just have to change
39:35 --> 39:38 a little bit. So, um, especially when you sell a vision over and over and
39:39 --> 39:41 over, right? And then you got to change it. That takes some real guts.
39:41 --> 39:44 Yeah, that's why we're looking for people that are humble enough to admit that,
39:44 --> 39:47 hey, maybe I'm not going the right direction, or maybe my idea isn't the right
39:47 --> 39:50 one, and willing to listen to even— like what Zach said—
39:51 --> 39:54 even somebody that's been here 3 days, because it's like Good ideas come from anywhere,
39:56 --> 40:00 and, and I think just understanding that is— All
40:00 --> 40:03 right, guys, well, uh, let the audience know how they can find you
40:03 --> 40:06 guys. Yeah, so you can go to lifestyleengr.com,
40:08 --> 40:13 that's our engineering website, or you can go to lifestylemfg.com
40:13 --> 40:17 for our manufacturing group. And we're just a phone call away or an email,
40:17 --> 40:20 and we, uh, we love jumping all over that and giving people
40:20 --> 40:24 opportunities. But Um, I hope that some of the stuff we talked about today even
40:24 --> 40:28 is just good for the general entrepreneur. I hope that some of the principles that
40:28 --> 40:32 we've learned in medical devices, they go to product development and idea development everywhere.
40:32 --> 40:36 Yeah. And the other thing too is if you just go to the Lifestyle ENGR,
40:36 --> 40:39 there's a link to every single one of our, um, kind of
40:40 --> 40:44 sister companies of the Lifestyle Medical. So we have a
40:45 --> 40:48 nonprofit as well, and then we have a 3D additive printing facility
40:49 --> 40:52 as part of it as well. Yep. All right guys, well thank you so much,
40:52 --> 40:56 Zach, Micah, for being on The Personal Side of Business. Thanks for having
40:56 --> 40:57 us. Appreciate it.